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Message: [QUOTE="OXY-351, post: 3460076, member: 2107"] I understand all of that. But you either seem to be missing the point/question, or ignoring it. From the moment the bookie accepted the deposit from a source not in bookmaker account holders name and allow the account to start placing bets, how can they really lose? Either the account ends in profit, and they just say they are not paying the winnings as their t&c's were breached, and they will refund the original deposit. Or the account loses money, and they'll either pay the balance out, or refund the original deposit if the owner of the source choses to say it was fraudulently used (which I suspect in the vast majority of cases, like you say when people are just trying to cheat the system, people aren't going to say that their partner, mate, kid etc committed fraud) And is it really fraud if they owner of the source has given you permission to use that source? Sure it might be against the t&c's of the bookmaker and the card issuer, but it is actually against the law? If the bookmakers were really worried about "fraud", they'd stop the account from betting the moment they knew it was funded from a source not in the account holders name, which they should be able to do well before months down the track when someone attempts to withdraw some winnings. So in that respect, no, I don't have much sympathy for them the times they have to refund genuine fraud cases. I'm sure they're not being lax on these initial checks knowing that they will lose long term out of it. [/QUOTE]

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